Watch towers (tier2)

Discussion in 'EMPIRE (by Crazy Monkey Studios)' started by XehutL, Nov 10, 2013.

  1. XehutL

    XehutL New Member


    I don't get why to ever choose on T2 the Watch towers over Farms (v1.1). Everytime I tried to built them, it spans within one or two turns very strong monter attack, which will most likely wipe out all my full army (yes, I know that there are actually only 2 losses at max). On the other hand, the Farms provide more land and more resources, which can help to prolong the current city lifetime... which is IMO much better.

    Anyone has the same experience?
  2. Fantom

    Fantom New Member

    Not sure... Especially because I never care about food... There must be something wrong with food because it never raises any issue, you can just ignore it... That why I never build any farm... Do you see any reason (except the point of 'resource') to care about land?
  3. XehutL

    XehutL New Member

    Farms add any resources from next surrounding squares - not just food, correct? Plus, they (currently) do not start any new "auto" attack within next 2 turns..
  4. keithburgun

    keithburgun Administrator, Lead Designer Staff Member

    I actually agree that Farms are kinda imba. I take them every time. Definitely will be addressing this in the future, in the 1.2 update. I don't know what you mean by "starting auto attacks" though.
  5. Nachtfischer

    Nachtfischer Well-Known Member

    What do you mean "food is not an issue"? More food gets you more city upgrades, so more is always better. I personally build farms all the time and agree that they are generally better (exception would be an already incoming attack maybe).

    I haven't noticed an "auto attack" caused by Watchtowers. If that should be in the game, I can't imagine it's a wanted behavior. Maybe a bug?
  6. XehutL

    XehutL New Member

    Whenever I built them, their "revealing" ability discovers several Hives(?) - out of which then (usually immediately on the next turn) an attack againts one of my cities starts (with common ETA 3 turns). And more over, quite strong attacks it is: generally more then 6 monsters & one of them beeing super monster. This often ironically ends with the town, that builded the Towers, destroyed.

    If I choose the Farms over the Towers, it seems that no nearby Hive under the fog of war starts any attack within next turns. Or most likely: it seems to be no attack until I discover that particular Hive by any means.
  7. Bucky

    Bucky Well-Known Member

    I sometimes take Towers over Farms in order to not generate desolation as quickly.
  8. Fantom

    Fantom New Member

    Okay, I wasn't clear... I prefer forecasting attacks and slowing desolation more than accelerating upgrades... Maybe I'm wrong... I'll try farms instead and will go back to you...
  9. keithburgun

    keithburgun Administrator, Lead Designer Staff Member

    Discovering hives won't cause them to attack you. There's no relationship there at all.
  10. XehutL

    XehutL New Member

    Are you sure? It is hard to say what would happen if - as there is no save/load option.
    For me, it seems to have the same pattern so far: if I choose the Farms, rarely any Hive attack will come in the next 3-5 turns. If I choose the Towers, almost always one Hive attack will spawn within the next 3-5 turns.

    Btw, I'm speaking about the upgrades from the first or second city.

    Btw2, if there is just some randomization, I'll rather do more testing yet.... May it be that it was (up to this moment) just a baaad luck (approx. 10 games in 1.1, ~5 with farms and 1 attack & ~5 with towers and 4/5 attacks).
  11. Nachtfischer

    Nachtfischer Well-Known Member

    I just played the first ~15 turns of 5 games. I did nothing but upgrade my starting city to the Watchtower and then wait ~10 turns. No attack incoming. Only the usual 1-2 (level 1) monster hives.

    If there is a connection, it would have to be caused by other factors besides the Watchtower. Maybe you have to have 3 cities? Maybe it was really just random and there is no pattern and everything works as intended.
    keithburgun likes this.
  12. Paul Rozie

    Paul Rozie New Member


    Whether you choose farms or watch tower, there is no difference in the chance that you get attacked.

    There is however an indirect increase in chance of getting attacked after you upgrade a city. This is because any city upgrade (this includes all the possible upgrades including settlers, material influx, free exploration, farms, watch towers, etc.) will upgrade all existing monster nests(*). Once a monster nest is tier 3, it has a high chance of attacking you in the next turn. So if there was a tier 2 monster nest you didn't knew of, it will have a high chance of attacking you once you complete a watch tower (or farms ... or material influx... or ...).

    So if you don't want to get attacked by monster nests when choosing a watch tower, you need to build your watch towers earlier or you should explore more ... or just can try to beat them like a boss but it probably isn't worth the low Victory Points you get for defending that push ;).

    Hope that clears things up,
    Paul Rozie
    Crazy Monkey Studios

    (*) The exact rule is that it gains 2 more monsters (or 1 super monster), but in most cases this leads to an upgrade of the monster nest tier.
    Nachtfischer likes this.
  13. XehutL

    XehutL New Member

    Paul, thank you for clearing the mechanics.

    I made more tests and it is definitely random and seems to behave as you described.
    The cause for the attacks I have experienced is most likely because I was choosing "free" exploration regulary and because the Farms perform better than Towers through speeding the play (they are simply better for economic).

    However, my recommendation is to keep the Farms same, and instead of their dowgrade, enhance the Towers somehow. Maybe it would be a good idea to provide their redraw ability cumulatively for EVERY battle in example (i.e. not just defense of the city, in which they are built). The players need some way how to manage their hands - at the moment it is just too random, and it only go worse as the deck is beeing flooded more and more by Desolation cards.

    IMO, the Towers should improve the overall combat ability for player, while the Farms the economic (that do the additional tiles).

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