Music Thread (anything to do with music is ok)

Discussion in 'Other Topics' started by deluks917, Apr 23, 2016.

  1. Erenan

    Erenan Well-Known Member

    I haven't spent a lot of time listening to DM, but I did enjoy that Sentenced song maybe at like a 7.5 or 8 out of 10. My experience with DM has been that 99% of it seems to me to be primarily useful to people who are really into the subculture and the scene and all that, and I am definitely not that (same for Black Metal probably). I am mainly interested in heavy metal for the compositional, thematic, and ideological ideas on a high conceptual level of abstraction, with the exception of a select number of artists who really resonate with me well on a more detailed level, mostly from more progressive and thrashy areas, but not exclusively.

    I guess someone interested in listening to music with screaming in it for superficial reasons might also find basically all of DM useful for their purposes. Again, that's not me.

    Anyway, here are some examples of DM that I found interesting on at least a B Tier level:

    The End of All Reason: (Melodic Tech Death, for me this is like B+ Tier. This whole album is def worth listening to IMO.)

    Parasitic Extirpation: (Tech/Brutal) (This is a full album, you don't have to listen to all of it if you don't want to. Eh, this is a B- really.)

    BarĂºs - "Chalice": (I LOVE this track! A Tier)

    And though it isn't DM, I'll post some additional metal that I like a lot for good measure:

    Absu - "Sceptre Command": (This is A++ Tier very important material for me. Truly a perfect magic spell of mythological occult metal mayhem IMO.)

    Aspid - Extravasation: (A- Tier Russian techno-thrash. Vocals are really really good if you ask me.)

    I haven't listened to the Carly Rae Jepsen album. Probably won't have any time to do so in the next two weeks. If timing were better, I'd give it a listen and tell you what I think.
    Juli and alastair like this.
  2. Juli

    Juli Well-Known Member

    I'm not at all into the scene. Mostly because I don't like going to concerts. I only recently go into "traditional" Death Metal, actually. I'd listened to Dark Tranquillity and Insomnium before, but that was about it. Last summer, a friend recommended me Bolt Thrower, and I enjoyed it and went off in search of more. My view of (non-melodic) Death Metal prior to then had been sort of the pop-culture stereotype of it being all about BRUTAL HEAVINESS PRAISE SATAN'S COCK. Basically I thought everything was Slam and Deathcore.

    Anyways when I found Swedish 90's Death Metal I absolutely fell in love with the genre. The two biggest reasons I've come to like Death Metal is for its moodiness/atmosphere, and for its ability to just pump me up. A lot of Swedish/Finnish stuff falls into one of these two camps perfectly. The Sentenced song I posted earlier is a good example of the former, while something like Override of the Overture is a good example of the latter.

    I haven't really been able to get into pure black metal. I feel as though I am missing something there I would enjoy, because I really like black/thrash and black/death. Pure Holocaust is the only album from the big names of Black Metal that I've enjoyed so far. That intro riff really hooked me.

    Aspid and Absu both kinda remind me of Sabbat, though in different ways. Here's a song off their album Satanasword, a.k.a. SALADSWORD.

    Can you expand on this? I know what all these words mean, just not when they're put together in this order.
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2017
  3. Erenan

    Erenan Well-Known Member

    I mean like, Death Metal is very frequently associated with materialist nihilism and mindless violence and mutilation. Black Metal is linked to e.g. the unholy, the awe of the unfathomable, powerful spirits rendering judgment upon those unworthy, anguish, etc. Metal on the whole is about rebellion. Power Metal can be understood broadly as an escape into fantasy coupled with the defiant rejection of a mainstream culture that condemns the fantasy for its cheesiness/nerdiness. That kind of thing.
    Juli likes this.
  4. Erenan

    Erenan Well-Known Member

    Probing to gauge interest...

    Would anyone be at all interested in having a music creation activity of some kind? When I was in college we did this exercise once where each person in my class chose a piece of music to listen to, drew a picture inspired by that music, and then we all traded pictures and wrote pieces of music inspired by the pictures.

    There ended up being no discernible relationship between the initial and final pieces of music directly, but it was interesting to see how different the steps from A to B and from B to C were, even though B was the same in both cases. Anyway, a lot of the music that came out of the exercise turned out to be some of (what I considered) the best and most interesting music anyone in our class produced. It was also fun!

    Anyone remotely interested in doing something like this? To participate, it is not necessary to be good at either composing or drawing, but I suppose it would help to be able to actually make music in some form, even if that's just making MIDI files or something. People don't necessarily all work at the same pace, though, so I'm not sure about timeframes.
  5. Bucky

    Bucky Well-Known Member

    How would you suggest the non-musicians among us make music?
  6. keithburgun

    keithburgun Administrator, Lead Designer Staff Member

    I'd love to do something like that! Don't have a recommendation for non-musicians though.
  7. Erenan

    Erenan Well-Known Member

    Well, I mean, I guess at least more than absolute zero knowledge of music is basically required.

    Did you mean writing it or creating a product to share? For writing, I was thinking you can just try it and see what happens. I encourage people to try new things they've never done before. Anyway, you could try ToneMatrix or Grid Music. If you have access to a musical instrument of some kind, you could just sort of plunk out some rough blah or something and record it. You can also resort to constrained randomness, like okay, for the first ten seconds I'll play random notes in this part of the piano, then hit this specific bunch of keys three times, then random notes in this other part, and then I'm done (or similar). That kind of thing is pretty easy to do, even if it's not very musical in a pop music or common practice period sense.

    Anyway, it's only an idea. If we determine that it's not practical given the people who frequent DF, well, it doesn't need to happen.
  8. major_shiznick

    major_shiznick Well-Known Member

    I am probed and interested!

    I think the musical Telephone thing is neat; maybe something similar with a lower barrier to entry would work well for us. I'm thinking something akin to musical Pictionary instead: participants are given an image prompt submitted by another participant.
  9. Erenan

    Erenan Well-Known Member

    Yeah that could work. My barrier to entry is reversed. Good at music. Garbage at graphic arts.
  10. keithburgun

    keithburgun Administrator, Lead Designer Staff Member

    La La Land was an original musical from last year and they tried to do like a Richard Rodgers thing but really did not have the writing ability to make it work. Most songs have an OK A section and then fall apart. The best song on the soundtrack though is this one.
  11. keithburgun

    keithburgun Administrator, Lead Designer Staff Member

    Check out the Katamari Amore OST. Playlist!
    BrickRoadDX likes this.
  12. Bucky

    Bucky Well-Known Member

    I found an answer to this.

    Tl;dw: Euro-Classical keyboard music was written for instruments tuned differently from a modern piano, which gave distinct feels to certain keys. Nowadays, there are technical reasons to choose specific keys for specific instruments, such as preferring black keys on a piano or using open strings on a guitar or violin family instrument. Master composers also take into account the instrument's timbre (i.e. the spectrum of pitches produced as a side effect by other parts of the instrument resonating with the tuned, pitch-generating component).
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2017
    keithburgun likes this.
  13. keithburgun

    keithburgun Administrator, Lead Designer Staff Member

  14. Bucky

    Bucky Well-Known Member

    I brought up some Chopin etudes earlier in the thread. Although we only discussed a few of them, the thread inspired me to study them seriously for composition techniques. As a little thank-you, I'd like to present one of my findings, namely...

    Rhythmic Ambiguity, featuring Chopin's Butterfly Etude (Op 25.9)

    ...but first, let's talk about parallel octaves. This means two different voices playing an octave apart for a few notes in a row. It's usually bad because the voices sound like they merge, leaving a 'hole' in the music's complexity. But this etude's melody is about half parallel octaves! What gives?

    Chopin uses the parallel octaves' merging to make it sound like the same melody has two different rhythms. The pattern is an octave jump followed by a pair of parallel octaves. So one of the voices repeats a rhythm of 8th-16th-16th, while the other is syncopated - (rest)-16th-16th-16th. And the octave gap makes them merge. As a result, the rhythm sounds like it 'flutters' on the first beat.

    Combining the half-syncopated rhythm with the off-beat chords gives the etude a strong ragtime feel, even though it predates ragtime by about 80 years.
  15. keithburgun

    keithburgun Administrator, Lead Designer Staff Member

    Hey guys, I need more video game music. I love MELODIC stuff, like Castlevania, Final Fantasy, etc. I just found the DARK LORD OST which seems pretty good. I need more stuff though so send it over!
  16. richy

    richy Well-Known Member

    An oldie: Deus Ex (TOG) was great. Some tracks have more of a song-like structure than others but even the ambient stuff is very melodic.

    MP3s used to be knocking around but I don't know whether they are any more. Youtube though:
  17. Laukku

    Laukku Well-Known Member

    EDIT: Forgot the Harry Potter games by Jeremy Soule.
    EDIT2: Replaced QfG2 OST with a pure MT-32 one, added more games (S.O.S./Septentrion, Maui Mallard, Prince of Persia for DOS & SNES, Pekka Kana 2), spoilered list as not to clutter thread.
    EDIT3: Found a GM recording of Death Gate on YouTube, so replacing with that although the playlist lacks the intro music.
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2018 at 1:06 PM
  18. Bucky

    Bucky Well-Known Member

    I recently came across a chord progression:
    C, C7, F, F7, A

    The F7 -> A transition works, but I couldn't figure out the music theory behind why it would. The first four chords share the key of Bb Major, but the A major chord is hard to fit in despite being only a half step away. @blakereynolds ?
  19. Erenan

    Erenan Well-Known Member

    Think about harmonic changes in terms of individual voices and how they can move to yield the next chord.

    F7 = F A C Eb
    A = A C# E

    Note that the F and the Eb can move in half-steps in contrary motion, both arriving at E. C similarly can move a half-step to arrive at C#. A needn't move as it is in the A Major chord. Eb moving upward is a bit of a subversion of standard voice leading because the 7th of the dominant (e.g. the Eb in the F chord in Bb Major) usually resolves downward to the 3rd of the tonic (e.g. the D in the Bb chord).

    F and Eb moving in contrary motion reminds of French augmented sixth chords, where the augmented sixth resolves outward into an octave. (e.g. C E F# A# -> B D# F# B). Of course, in the F7->A case what's happening is a bit different because the minor seventh is resolving outward, but the doubled pitch is the fifth rather than the root.

    Key changes and mode mixtures (using chords that don't strictly belong to the key you're playing in) often work best when they subvert your expectations. You expect a voice to resolve in a particular way, and you are surprised when it moves somewhere different from what you expected. You can even strengthen the effect by repeating the expected thing a few times and then changing it. So for instance, if you go C-C7-F-F7-Bb a few times in the song, you might later be able to effectively transition into a bridge by instead going C-C7-F-F7-A as a surprise. You could probably leverage this to introduce a key change into A Major or D Major or something.

    Also note that in Bb Major, a C Major chord is actually a mode mixture already. You're using that C7, borrowed from F Major, as a secondary dominant to strengthen the transition to F. In Bb Major, Cm is the expected chord, not C Major.
    keithburgun and Bucky like this.
  20. keithburgun

    keithburgun Administrator, Lead Designer Staff Member

    Erenan nailed it!

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